Home Secretary James Cleverly defends James Sunderland after he described Rwanda policy as 'crap'

James Cleverly has said his parliamentary aide James Sunderland was making a “counterintuitive statement” for dramatic effect when he described the Rwanda policy as “crap”. The Home Secretary told Sky News’ Sunday Morning with Trevor Phillips he was surprised by the story about the leaked recording because Mr Sunderland was “very supportive” of the policy.

Former aide to the Home Secretary, Mr Sunderland, who is standing in the Bracknell ward he won in 2019, was recorded telling a private event “the policy is crap, OK? It’s crap”. According to the BBC, a video from a Young Conservatives event in April shows Mr Sunderland continued by defending the plan, saying it would deter migrants from attempting to cross the Channel.

Saying the “effect of the policy” was what mattered, he added: “There is no doubt at all than when those first flights take off that it will send such a shockwave across the Channel that the gangs will stop.”

The BBC said he also criticised colleagues for “courting controversy”, naming then MPs and current Conservative candidates Jonathan Gullis and Brendan Clarke Smith as those who “polarise opinion”, alongside former Tory MP Lee Anderson who switched to Reform in March.

Mr Sunderland, who worked as a parliamentary private secretary to Mr Cleverly and Suella Braverman, told the BBC he was “disappointed” at being recorded at a private event. He said: “I was talking about the response to the policy. The policy itself is not the be all and end all but part of a wider response.”

In response to the criticism of colleagues, he said he was answering a question about resignations from party posts by saying “unnecessary rhetoric and division in public life” was unnecessary.

Defending his colleague this morning Mr Cleverly said: “I’ve had a conversation with him and I’ve also heard the recording. And it’s clear what he’s doing is he’s putting forward a very counterintuitive statement to grab the attention of the audience. If you actually listen to what he then went on to say, he was saying that the impact, the effect, is what matters.”

The Home Secretary added: “He did it clearly for dramatic effect to grab the attention of the audience.But he is – and it’s clear in the recording – completely supportive of the deterrent effect that the Rwanda policy has.”